The History of Restoration Abraham's Family 3

Shall we uh make a start? Yes please. Yes. Okay. As I said, I was just having a little conversation there as I got set up. Anyway, so I said I'm sorry for being late. It just took me h two and a/4 hours to get here from Chisel House. It's solid. There was some big demonstration in Whiteall in Trafalga Square. So all the roads are closed off there and the roads were going through the west completely solid. Don't know who is demonstrating. So somebody sorry somebody demonstrating anyway the bankers the bankers are demonstrating bigger bonuses. All right.

So we're looking now at Abraham's course and so we looked at um hey the big picture is that God wants us to uh send a Messiah. So in order for God to be able to send the Messiah, somebody has to make the foundation of faith and the foundation of substance to be able to create an environment in which the Messiah can be understood and can be accepted. And so God uh tried through to do that in Adam's family, it didn't work. Tried to do it. Noah's family didn't work. And so God found Abraham or Abraham found God rather.

And then God started working through Abraham. And we saw there how he wasn't able to restore the foundation of faith through his off offering. And so God then gave him a second chance. Okay. So did we look at this last week? We did, didn't we? Yep. And we looked at that and that and that and we were going to go on to this. So this is the second opportunity then that Abraham has to restore the foundation of faith. So the foundation of faith was supposed to have been established by Adam and Eve.

And Adam and Eve should have had faith in God's commandment or God's word. They should have united with God's commandment and trusted in God. But they didn't. And so this foundation of faith that Adam and Eve should have made needs to be restored. And so a Abraham wasn't able to restore it because he didn't make the offering correctly. And so he has a second chance then to restore the foundation of faith. So this time God has Abraham do something which is more difficult. If God asked Abraham to do the same thing again, do you think he would have got it wrong the second time round? No. No.

So in that case, do you think Satan wouldn't have been satisfied with him to get a second chance to restore the foundation of faith just in the same way? So in order for God to be able to allow Abraham to make the found restore the foundation of faith, Satan said, "Okay, he can do it, but this time he has to offer something much more difficult." And so this time uh God the agreement was that Abraham could restore the foundation of faith if he would offer his son Isaac as a burnt offering. So God said to Abraham, "Take your son, your only son whom you love,

and offer him as a burnt offering." So Abraham rose early in the morning. So it's a bit shocking that, isn't it? Don't you find that shocking? God says, "Take your son, your only son, Isaac, whom you love, and offer him as a burnt offering." So Abraham rose early in the morning. Child sacrifice is like the biggest Okay. Right. So that that that is shocking the fact that the idea. But what what's also shocking? The only son your only son. Yeah. Finish his lineage. Yes. Of the end of his lineage. A huge escalation between previous slept. That's Yeah. That's interesting, isn't it?

So Abraham rose early in the morning. He got up early. When God told Abraham he's going to destroy Sodom and Gomorrah, how did Abraham respond? He argued. He argued with God. He had a long argument with God about not destroying these wicked cities where all this bad stuff was going on. He argued and argued got it all the way down from 50 to 10. But he didn't argue with God about sacrificing his son. Why was that? Why not? Why did he argue about Sodom and Gomorrah? Is it because he's showing more? Well, when when he he when he was in regards to Solomon, he he challenged God. He says, "Is it right

that the innocent should perish together with the guilty? Shouldn't the God of this world be just?" In other words, he's telling God, "It's wrong." In other words, in his depth of his being, Abraham felt this is not right. It's unfair for the innocent to be destroyed together with the guilty. So why didn't he react in that way here? He probably he probably had a pretty conscience from the failure of the offering basically you know that he felt somehow that he was indebted to God in that sense really God to do something right to really come to God's side anyway.

and come and coming from side. I mean, yeah, I at the end of the day, I think he must have felt this is the right thing to do. The end of the day, I think he must have felt in his heart of hearts, he must have felt this is the right thing to do. I And I'm also sure he must have felt I don't understand why, but for some reason, it's necessary for me to offer my son as a sacrifice. Yeah, he must have Why didn't he think the same way about that too? Because he in the depth of his being he felt it was wrong.

So in that sense he was listening to his conscience. His conscience somehow intuition his heart told him this is right. Whereas when it came to Sodom and Gomorrah he felt this is wrong. So in that sense he's very much in touch with the deeper part of himself. Yeah. He wasn't just making his decisions, you know, intellectually out of his head. It was some whole being, he felt that's wrong and was willing to risk his life arguing with God about it. But here, the depths of being he felt, as much as he didn't like to hear it, he felt actually

that is the right thing to do. I need to do this. I don't understand why, but it's just something that I need to do in order for and you know, he believed in God. He trusted God. He knew God was good. He knew God would never ask him to do something that was wrong. He knew God was trustworthy and he just, you know, couldn't understand why it was necessary, but he just felt actually it's a necessary thing to do. And um yeah, so it's like a condition of greater indemnity then. And so it was also yes also in

that sense a test to see if Abraham loved God more than anything else. So what what uh profession did Abraham's father have? Idol maker. He's an idol maker. So he worshiped idols. And so the question is you know was you can imagine Abraham must have loved Isaac with his whole heart with his whole being. You can imagine Abraham would have preferred to kill himself than to kill his son. Yeah. So the question is you know did did God did Abraham love and worship Isaac more than he loved and worshiped God in

that sense? Had Abraham become like an idol maker an idoltor and so willing you. It's like a sort of test to see you if he loved him above everything. And so it took three days then to go from to get up, you know, got up early in the morning, took three days travel to go to Mount Mariah, which is where the the the temple of Jerusalem was later built. And then on the way, I generally understood Isaac was probably about a teenager. And of course on the way Isaac would have said you know where is the

um well what he did say in the Bible it says where's the you know we got the wood we got the fire but where's the offering and then Abraham said God will provide the offering and so Isaac then realized that actually he was the one that was going to be the offering and so what did he do? Did he get on the phone and say, "Child line, please. Can I put me through the children the social services? A serious case of child abuse is about to take place." But he didn't say, "Why not?" Well, Ishmael was already out of it by then. Yes. Yeah.

And um though Isaac then also, you know, he must have known what kind of a person his father was. He must have loved his father. Must have known his father as a good person, a sincere person, a devote devouted, a devout person. And also he must have felt my dad would never do anything that was wrong. May there must be some reason why God has told him to offer me as a sacrifice in order for God's providence to go ahead. I can't he couldn't understand why, but he had this trust and this faith in his father

and also in God. And so it's called the binding of Isaac because actually Isaac was bound. His hands and his feet were bound. And in the Talmud it says that um that Isaac said to Abraham, "Please bind up my feet and bind up my my legs in case at the last moment I you know I can't control myself and I jump off the the altar and I spoil the offering. So please in case I show any sign of weakness, please bind me my my feet and my legs. So that sort of you know incredible faith. And so Abraham then you know was about to to kill Isaac

and then an angel intervene and said do not lay your hand on the lad or do anything to him for now I know you fear God seeing you've not withheld your son your only son from me. And so at that point because he's showing this willingness then it beca it was no longer necessary uh for for you know God obviously didn't want Abraham to sacrifice Isaac but he showed that kind of willingness to do so which is something which is quite extraordinary and so he didn't need to do that and so then through this

then Isaac inherited Abraham's mission and the angel of the Lord said to Abraham I swear by myself declares the Lord but because you've done this and have not withheld your son, your only son. I will surely bless you." And so Isaac then restores Ham's mistake. So if you remember, Ham didn't have this unity of heart with Noah. So Isaac then having this complete unity of heart with Noah, then he restored Ham's mistake. And so both of them together, they showed absolute love, absolute faith, and absolute obedience.

And then together they found there's a ram caught in a thicket. And they went and got the ram, killed it, sacri, you know, slit its throat and together they offered this ram as an offering. So that then became the their foundation of faith, the offering which they offered together. And so that's why uh Jews blow the chauffar, this ram's horn, they blow it to remind themselves of that sacrifice. And you know, he brought up Islam. So Muslims believe any the Bible it says that Abraham offered Isaac or God told Abraham to offer Isaac

and Abraham was willing to offer Isaac. But Muslims gen Muslims believe that Abraham was going to offer Ishmael. [Music] Okay. But actually if you look at the Quran, the Quran doesn't say that. The Quran just says offer your son. It doesn't say Isaac. It doesn't say Ishmail. It just says offer your son. And some Muslims interpret this to meansh. So what's going on here? Do you think the Muslims viewing it? H do you mean by the Muslims viewing it? Why? Even though it doesn't say in the Quran Ishmamail, they they understand this son was Ishmael. Why do you think why do you think that's the case?

Because they're descended from their descendant of Ishmael. So it makes sense who submits to right it's more prestigious to be descended from the one the son who's willing to you know make that kind of offering of you know self sacrifice um but anyway as said the the Bible says Isaac and so I have come across some Muslims who say well actually the Jews went and the rabbis went and rearranged Genesis. Well, they say that the original text of Genesis said Ishmael, but then they went and rearranged it to say Isaac. The early Muslims, I'm sure, right? It's a later tradition. Yeah, it's a later tradition. Yeah.

So, anyway, it's interesting. In the Quran, that is. Sorry. You know which passage in the Quran? Just No, if you got a Quran, just look it up in the index. I haven't got the reference here. Just look up. I just look up the Yeah. Okay. So in that case then Abra Isaac then inherited Abraham's foundation of faith. And then next is for the foundation of substance to be established. And so um after Sarah died then um Abraham sent uh his slave or servant to um back to Haran to get a wife for Isaac.

And so he got Rebecca who was Laban's um sister and uh she came and then she was very beautiful and you know Isaac and Rebecca really loved each other. There's lots of passages there which talk about that and Isaac and Rebecca had uh you know after many many years Rebecca became pregnant and then when she was pregnant it was incredibly painful for her and so she prayed to God and said to God you know it would have been better not to get pregnant have to go through all this incredible pain. Then God said to her two nations are in your womb

and two peoples born of you shall be divided. The one shall be stronger than the other. The elder shall serve the younger. Okay. The elder shall serve the younger. So you can imagine then this is the revelation she had. So you can imagine this would have made an incredible impact upon her. Yes. God spoke to her. He had two sons. One called Jacob uh who and one called Esau. So Esau was the older son and he's described being hairy and Jacob's younger son described being smooth skinned. So what can you tell about them? Were they identical or non identical twins? Nonidentical. Nonidentical. That's right. Okay. Anyway,

so also Rebecca went through the similar kind of experience that Sarah went through. Were you all here when I explained this last week? Was I here last week? Week before. Was it the week before I explained this? Were you all here the week before? No. I need to go through it again. Right. Okay. Sorry. go through quickly. Anyway, so um what what happened then is is Isaac and Rebecca they went to um a town where the king of Ger where Aimilec who was the king of Gerard lived and then they were sitting there

and then Aimilec saw how beautiful Rebecca was. So invited Isaac and Rebecca to tea and then Isaac pretended that he was that they were brother and sister. So Aimilec said to Rebecca after tea, why would you like to stay the night? And so Isaac went off and Rebecca stayed the night. And you can imagine then Rebecca living in this beautiful palace. And you can imagine she went to bed, a lovely feather bed, beautiful silks, a wardrobe full of shoes, you know, maids to do her fingers and everything.

And then you can imagine in the middle of the night then Aimilec came along, knocked on her door and tried to seduce her. And she had a choice then. Was she going to become the wife of a king and live in a palace or was she going to remain the wife of Isaac and live in a tent? Yeah. Anyway, so that was her choice. So just as Lucifer looked much more attractive to Eve than Adam, then Eve gave into that and became infatuated with Lucifer and went after Lucifer because he appeared to be much greater, much more powerful, much more knowledgeable than than Adam was.

And so in order to restore that, women often have to go through the same kind of situation where they have to choose between getting married to a very very powerful king or very powerful rich person or remaining faithful to the person they're already married to. So Rebecca had this temptation. She overcame this temptation and then the next morning God told Aimilec actually she is the wife of Isaac who is my prophet. And then felt really shocked and so he returned Rebecca to Isaac and also gave them lots of wealth.

And so this is like restoring the Lucifer, Eve, Adam kind of relationship. So it's the restoration of Eve, the purification of the lineage. So okay. All right. So Jacob and Esau then they were quite different characters and as they were growing up when they got a bit older then Isaac this is little bit extra bits from the Talmud. Isaac told his sons when they were getting sort of teenagers that about the birthright and uh they wondered what was this birthright and and Isaac explained well the eldest son is the one who will inherit the birthright

and the birthright means that when I die he will inherit the land and also he'll inherit the responsibility of being the head of the family guiding the family in worship in prayer and all these things and so said Well, I like the idea of getting all the land, but I'm not really keen on all this worshiping God business. Cuz Esau was a kind of person he liked to go hunting into the forest, killing animals. And that was he was that kind of a person, a man's man. Whereas Jacob liked to stay at home

and he liked to be involved in reading the scriptures, not that there were any at that stage, and uh helping his mom out. And you know, he's a a much more a religious kind of person, a spiritual, a very spiritual person. Strong. Yeah. Anyway, one day, Esau been out had been out hunting and he hadn't caught anything and he was really hungry. So, he came home and he found went into the kitchen and he saw um Jacob cooking something on the gas stove and he said to Jacob, "I'm starving. Will you give me something to eat?"

And Jacob said, "Well, I'm sorry. I can't give you this food because I'm preparing um lentil soup for dad." And Esau said, "Lent soup? Why do you feed him such rubbishy food? Why don't you give him a decent meal?" And um Jacob said, "Well, I'm giving him lentil soup because he's in mourning because our f our grandfather Abraham has passed away. And so because he's in mourning, that's why he's eating this very simple food." And um Esau sort of, you know, okay, but anyway, would you let would you sell me some, please?

And Jacob said, "Okay, I'll sell it to you. what will you give me? And Esau said, I'll give you my birthright. And Jacob said, fine, okay, I'll take the birthright in exchange for some soup. And so Jacob bought the birthight from Esau. Did Esau offer it or did Jacob name it as a miss what he just said? He still offered it because the story goes that uh there's a bit more conversation in the Talmud that Esau didn't like you couldn't understand why does Jacob respect Abraham. Well, Jacob respected

and Isaac respected Abraham because he's a prophet and a religious person. And Esau said, "Oh, I don't believe in God. I'm not a religious kind of person. I don't have much respect for that kind of thing and I don't really have much respect for this birthright because it means that I have to lead the family in prayer and all this sort of thing. Lots of extra kind of conversations. Anyway, so it says in the Bible, thus Esau despised the birthight, didn't really value it. Anyway, so some years later when they're about about 40 years old,

then Isaac wanted to Isaac was going blind at this stage. He's very old, going blind. He was thinking about, well, maybe he's going to die soon. So, he decided he wanted to give his blessing to his sons and he wanted to give his blessing to Esau. So, he called Esau in and said to Esau, "I want to bless you before I die. But before I give you my blessing, I want you to go out and hunt and bring me my favorite meal." And so, Esau said, "Right, Dad." So off he went, got his bow and arrow, went off into the into the forest to

um shoot a deer so he can bring some venison for his dad to eat. But Rebecca overheard this conversation. She overheard Isaac saying this to Esau and she thought to herself, "Actually, I think Jacob is the one who deserves to get this blessing. Not Esau, but Jacob deserves to get the blessing." And so she said to Jacob, "Look, Jacob, Isaac's going to give his blessing to Esau, but you're actually the one that should get this blessing." And uh so why don't you go and kill the fatted calf, cook the food in the way your dad likes the food,

and then come and serve it to him, and then you can be the one that gets a blessing. But um Jacob was actually very reluctant to do this. He said, "Well, if dad discovers this, he's going to curse me instead of blessing me." So Rebecca said, "Well, if he does that, then I'll take responsibility. I'll take the blame for it." So Jacob then he um cooked Isaac his favorite meal. He dressed up and put on some, you know, some animal skins on his arms and everything and he went into to um see Isaac.

And Isaac said, "Who is it?" And Jacob said, "Um, it's himself." He didn't actually lie. Actually, I need to correct that. Um, if you read the Hebrew, it can be interpreted in a way which actually wasn't a lie. He said it is I and Esau is your eldest son. That's one. It can also be inter the English though it's I am Esau. The English it says, "I am Esau, your eldest son." Which is obviously a sorry sounds like a lie. Which is obviously a lie. But the Hebrew itself can be interpreted that way.

But also it could be interpreted it is I and Esau is your eldest son. Two factual statements. Yes. No. But the Hebrew the Hebrew itself is ambiguous. So it can be read in either way. So he wasn't telling a lie. what he said was strictly true if you interpret it one way. If you interpret it another way, it wasn't true. So in the English there's no ambiguity, but in the Hebrew there is ambiguity because in Hebrew is is a it's just a very different kind of language. Anyway, by the way, in Genesis it says Jacob suggests to Esau. All right. Okay. Thank you for that. I did.

So, I didn't have time to to I've been out traveling all day. I didn't have time to to read it up before I came back in. Okay. So, there we go. So, what do you think about this then? Jacob maybe doesn't like the idea of receiving his father, but he's trusting his mother's instinct. He's doing what his mother tells him to do. Yeah. He's a 40y old man. Yeah, sure. But you know, this is a while back. I mean, if you got if you when you if you're 40 years old and you got a mother who's 65 or 70, she can be pretty persuasive still. Sorry. That's right. Anyway,

um so let's have a look then. So then this is the blessing that Isaac wanted to give to Esau but that actually he gave to Jacob. May God give you heaven's dew and earth's richness and abundance of grain and new wine. May n may nations serve you and peoples bow down to you. Be lord over your brothers and may the sons of your mother bow down to you. May those who curse you be cursed and those who bless you be blessed. Any thoughts or comments on the on the on the nature of that blessing? What's it about? What kind of blessing is it? Well, I'm cheating

because I've seen your letter before but it's not striking or it's quite external. Yeah. In other words, can you you can have the heavens dew and earth richness and abundance of grain in your wine. that you can be prosperous and wealthy. Nations serve you and peoples bow down to you so you can have power. Be lord over your brothers and sons of your mother bow down to you. In other words, your younger brother will bow down to you and respect you. Okay. So, it's about wealth and power, isn't it? Basically. Yeah. Okay. Anyway,

and so when Esau came back, he came back with you actually he hadn't been according to the Talmud. He went out hunting. He couldn't catch anything. On the way home, he was so tired and you know fed up. He saw a dog, killed the dog, cooked the dog and brought the the dog, cooked dog in to Isaac to eat and Isaac smelt it said that smells like a dog, not not venison. And Esau said, "Eat up, Dad." You know, then give me the blessing. And then Isaac said, "Well, who are you?" And uh Esau said, "It's me. You know, I'm I'm Esau, your oldest son."

And then Isaac said, "I've already given you the blessing." And Isaac was really, you know, angry and upset and trembled with rage. And then, you know, Esau said, "Well, haven't you got another blessing for me?" And so, he uh Isaac gave a blessing to Esau, which is basically to say that his brother would dominate him. And um then Esau hated Jacob because of the blessing with which his father had blessed him. And Esau said to himself, "The days of mourning for my father are approaching. Then I'll kill my brother Jacob."

So what do you think of that? That good? It's like the Cain and Abel situation again. Cain again wants to kill Abel. So let's go on. So you can see here this mother son cooperation. What should have happened is Rebecca should have restored Eve and Sarah's role by helping her sons to love each other. Yeah. She should have helped them to get on with each other. But actually as they were growing up, they argued and they fought and they just didn't get on with each other at all. Yeah. So eventually one wanted to kill the other.

So in that sense, Rebecca didn't actually fulfill her role of being able to unite her sons and help to love each other. And she who did which son did she favor? Jacob the younger son. She favored Jacob probably based upon this dream. So in that sense she didn't really love them equally. She favored one over the other. Anyway, the good thing was she saved Jacob's life by sending him to Haran. And she said to him, look, I don't want you to get killed. I don't want have lose two sons in one day. Please you go to Haran

and stay there for a while. stay with my brother, your uncle Laban, until Esau cools down. And when he's cooled down, then you can come home again. And so before Isaac went, sorry, before Jacob went, he went to see his father and his father gave him a blessing. So let's have a look then at the blessing that Isaac gave to Jacob. May God Almighty bless you and make you fruitful and increase your numbers until you become a community of peoples. May he give you and your descendants the blessing given to Abraham

so that you may take possession of the land where you now live as an alien, the land God gave to Abraham. So what do you think about this blessing? The first part of the community of people is external sense. Okay. Does any of the words there remind you of anything? Yeah. Yeah. This is exactly this is so Isaac then is giving to Jacob the three blessings. Be fruitful, multiply, and have dominion over the land. Yeah. Okay. Be fruitful, multiply, and have dominion. And also, it's the blessing given to Abraham.

So you can be the one who in you're the heir to Abraham, Abraham, Isaac, Jacob. So of these two blessings, which one do you think is the most significant? The one that Isaac wanted to give to Esau or the one that Isaac wanted to the one that Isaac gave to Jacob. Have a let's just look at this one again. This one here is about wealth and power. Just is there any religious content here? If you look at the language, apart from God in the first sentence, is there any religious language in this or spiritual language? Not really, is there? Authority. Yeah. Now, if you look at this one here, there's a lot of religious language, isn't there? Fruitful multiply is about blessing. about Abraham. In other words, inheriting the blessing

that God gave to Abraham is about taking possession of the land of Canaan. It's full of religious language. Okay. So, what do you think about this situation then? Even when Isaac, do you have another blessing for me? He still told his son, right? Yeah. So, the way it looks to me is that Isaac thought to himself, right, I've got two sons. I want to give each of my sons a blessing. So, he prepared the blessing that he wanted to give to Esau, which is about wealth and power, because he knew that was what Esau was interested in.

And he had a second blessing that he wanted to give to Jacob, which was the birthright blessing. This is the this is a birthright blessing that the right to inherit Adam and Abraham's blessing. This is the blessing which is for the person who has a birthright. So Jacob won the bought the birthight from Esau. And so this is a blessing that goes along with having the birthright. Yeah. This is like the the blessing that's given to the eldest son or the son who's going to become head of the family. Yeah.

So do you think it was necessary then for Jacob to take Esau's blessing not think right so what was going on there then why did Rebecca suggest to Jacob that he go and take Esau's blessing I mean well she had an idea from this prophecy that was given Yes. Because after everything happens, you know, the scripture is written in this way. So she I guess she had this feeling or maybe the message was conveyed in that way and maybe it she interpreted it as as if she had to make it be that way instead of

so I mean who do you who do you think should get who do you think should give the blessing the father Isaac gives the blessing to Okay. Isaac gave the blessing to Esau and Jacob. Do you think that was right? That was tradition. The father man blessing together. Yes. So maybe Isaac and Rebecca should have given the blessing together. So what do you think? So what does that suggest then? Isaac and somehow yeah somehow there's a lack of unity there between Isaac and Rebecca. How can you tell that she can communicate? Right?

Because Rebecca overheard Isaac saying it. In other words, she was out of the loop. Isaac didn't discuss it with Rebecca beforehand. If Isaac had discussed it with Rebecca beforehand, then Rebecca would have known what was going on. But Rebecca just overheard Isaac saying this to Esau. And then she got the wrong end of the stick. She thought in the sense that she thought Isaac is going to give the blessing to Esau. She didn't realize Isaac had two blessings to give. Isaac had Isaac was a, you know, was no fool. Isaac had worked it all out in his head. He knew Jacob had the birthright. He knew Jacob was the one who's most qualified to receive the birthright blessing of Adam

and Abraham. And so he he prepared that blessing for Jacob. He also knew what kind of person his oldest son was. And he wanted to give a blessing to his oldest son as well. So he worked it all out in his head, but he hadn't discussed it with Rebecca. And so she misunderstood it. She thought he's just going to give everything to Esau. They This is how I understand it. When you look at the when you unpick it, it looks to me like they hadn't discussed it beforehand. First of all, they I think they should have given it together. Secondly, the very fact

that she only found out what was happening when she overheard Isaac talking about it meant they hadn't discussed it together. And so, I think she misinterpreted what was going on. And so the consequence of this was that Jacob got Esau's blessing. And how did Esau feel about it? Upset, he wanted to kill Jacob. This is almost like Cain killing Cain almost killed Abel again. And that would have been a complete catastrophe. What's necessary for the foundation substance is not that Jacob should take Esau's blessing. It's actually

that it's actually that um Jacob should win Esau's love and respect and uh you know they should cooperate and work together. when she got the revelation the younger the only will serve the younger I mean she's an old testament woman so she's obviously thinking in terms of like power and domination and also she actually loves Jacob more than Esau so do you think that she just thought in those terms and not so much enlightened terms anyway I think she's a I think she's a wonderful and extraordinary person

but you know she was also very human you these are extraordinary people but they're also very human all the issues and problems and difficulties that we have they have you know you know so often there's breakdown of communication in the family between a husband and wife and father and mother and you know that's often the issue it's you know with them as well as it is for us you think it was unusual for husbands to give the blessing without their wives present in those days I'm sure it wasn't just their family it was like

that same thing I don't know but what but all I can say is obviously See, they didn't they weren't communicating cuz Rebecca didn't know about it without overhearing it. So, there's obviously a lack of communication. They didn't wake up in the morning together and start to get the day with prayer. Let's What are we going to do today? Well, I would like to give Esau my blessing today. Oh, well, what are you going to etc., etc., etc. Yes. That's why it's always good, you know, wake up, start the day together, prayer

and discussion. What are we going to do today or what are we going to do this week or what are we going to do this month? That's why you know the sort of thing one does a pledge beginning of the day, beginning of the week, beginning of the month, beginning of the year. You know, you talk about what are we going what do we want to accomplish and do today, this week, this month, this year. Yeah. So, it can work together. I'm sorry to bring this up maybe on camera, but our church just teaches this part of the divine principle like, well, Rebecca was supposed to deceive, right? In

that kind of way. I think this is very enlightened way. I I think it's okay. So I'll tell you how I think okay this is what did happen then we have to think just because it did happen should it have happened like this and that's what you know sometimes you think oh this is because it happened like this therefore it's supposed to happen like this but let's try and think what how else could it have happened what else could have gone on so how did Jacob get the the birthright he bought it okay so how should

so did Esau respect Jacob do you think No. The how what should have happened? Like King Satan. Yes. So what should have happened is that Esau should have given the birthight to Jacob. Can you imagine that happening? Okay. So let's think about it. There are times in history where this sort of thing has happened. One is King Seong. I'll tell you about King Seong. He was a Korean king who um became a king and he created the Korean alphabet. But who normally becomes the king? First son, usually the first or the eldest son.

But Se Jong was actually the third son. He had two older brothers. So normally they should become the king before him. But what what happened is this. The two older brothers, they used to have conversations amongst each other. And they said to themselves, they said to each other, "Actually, out of the three of us, Sejong is the most qualified to become the next king. He's the one who's the wisest, the most intelligent, the best person, this, this, this, and this." All these qualities. Actually, he's much more qualified to become the king than us.

But the reality is that when dad dies, I'm going to become the king. And if I die, you're going to become the king. and Sjum's not going to become the king. So for the sake of the country actually it's better if we get ourselves disqualified from becoming the next king. And so what happens the two sons the two older sons they behaved so badly at the court that they were one was exiled well they were both exiled and one went left the country and the other one went became a Buddhist monk and so when the father died Sejong became the next king. Yes, that's the way that's how it happened for that. Remarkable. Also, similar thing happened with David

and Jonathan, which we'll look at later. So, what should have happened here is that Jacob should have behaved in as such a good younger brother and really admired and loved his older brother, but also been so wise that his older brother would have thought to himself, Esau should have thought to himself, "Wow, Jacob's amazing. He's such a loving brother. He really loves me so and really respects me." But actually he's so intelligent and so wise. I think he would become a better head of the fern family when Isaac dies.

And so he should have said given his birthright to Jacob because he should have done that. So what should have happened is Jacob for the foundation of substance Cain has to love Abel. In order for Cain to love Abel, what does Abel need to be? Lovable. Exactly. So Jacob should have one become lovable. Yes. And then so Esau sort of loved him also. Cain has to listen to Jacob. Okay. And respect him. So Abel has to be respectable. So Jacob then needed to be lovable, easy for his older brother to love him. He has to be easy for his older brother to respect him

because on the one hand he kept his position as a younger brother but also had all these amazing ideas etc etc and also then Esau Cain is supposed to follow Abel. So in order for Esau to follow Jacob, Jacob had to be lovable, easy to respect and so that Jake eyes Esau would have thought wow we can do stuff together. So for example, Esau used to enjoy going hunting. Actually, Jacob was much more much cleverer. So, Jacob as a younger brother said, "Wow, you know, I really love you, Esau, but you know, actually, I had this idea. You know, look, what do you think about this is another way of trapping an animal?" Yes. In other words, offered these ideas to Esau.

And Esau thought, "That's a great idea. Let's go and do it together." And so, together, they could have done all sorts of things. Yeah. In that sense, Es Jacob need to win Essel's respect. And then he would have got the birthight. And then things would have turned out very differently. Yeah. But actually Jacob bought the birthright and the principle it says he was very clever. He cleverly bought the birthright. In other words, he was a clever what do you call it? Clever dick. A clever dick. He tric sneaky. He tricked him,

but he didn't win his heart. He didn't win his respect. Yeah. And so Esau felt hard. Later on, Esau felt really hard done by. And so when Esau found that Jacob taken his blessing, he said, "He's taken my birthright and now he's taken my blessing." So he felt really, you know, hard done by that he'd sold his birthight for, you know, a bowl of lentil soup. So So originally, even though Lucifer was proud, if some time had passed without the fall, Adam would have become perfect and become so impressive, Lucifer would have admired him more

and more. Would have been happy to follow him. Of course. Yes. Yes. without the original things being brought. Yes. And that's what should have happened. And then Lucifer should have been the one to say to God, actually Adam and Eve are qualified and ready to get married. But because they gave into his temptation, of course, he couldn't respect them. But if they resisted the temptation, his respect for them would have grown more and more and more. And eventually, he would have his jealousy and resentment would have been nothing compared to his admiration for them. He wouldn't have felt jealous or resentful anymore

because he would have felt completely satisfied in love. He would have felt completely loved by Adam and Eve. So they would have subjugated natural talks about natural subjugation of Satan takes place through love. So through Adam and Eve should have loved Lucifer into submission. Yeah. So that's what Jacob should have done to Esau as well. Then things would have turned out very differently. So all that. So Jacob, he need to get the birthright and then he needed to get the the blessing that goes along with the birthight.

But he didn't need to get Esau's blessing because by taking Esau's blessing, all he did is he made Esau so angry and upset he wanted to kill him. Yes. If he hadn't taken Esau's blessing and just taken his own blessing, then you know, he wouldn't have got in a situation where he almost got himself killed. Okay. And so Jacob then sets off for Haran. On the way to Haran, he has this dream and uh of Jacob's ladder and uh God says to him, "I am the Lord. I'll give you and your descendants the land on which you're lying. It's the same blessing

that God gave to Isaac and and Abraham. Your descendants will be like the dust of the earth. all the peoples of the earth will be blessed through you and your offspring and I'll bring you back to this land. And so he goes off to Haram. Okay, it's 10 8 so I'm not going to finish this. 10 9 8 9 So it's Anyway, I don't want to rush through it. So better just go through it slowly. And this is now about the time I'd have finished anyway. Are we are we coming to next week? December. What's the date next week? 21st of December. 21st. Yes. Yes. Yes.

So yeah, next week but not the week after. Yeah. Not the 28th. Yes. I want to ask you when Korea's monarchy end where what? When did Korea's monarchy end? Korea's monarchy in about 1910. I tell you one thing about it that you know when SC had a monarchy and the monarchy um when the king had you know that there was an you know you know you know and he ended up killing about 200 two million husband for that time. Is it possible that the Quran had to end because God for saw God saw what happened the past time when there was a king on on his very throne

and then now he will send the Messiah and the king might begin to struggle again when when the Messiah came anyway you know you're I understand what you mean to be democracy. There need to be democracy. I mean uh I mean Korea was basically a very very feudal country. Yes. And uh there was no democratic element at all. Um ideally I think if Korea had reformed for a few hundred years before the 20th century and introduced welcome Christianity introduced democratic elements. I don't think there would be a problem having a king of Korea in a constitutional democracy like we have in this country. It's not a problem.

And then maybe father could have married into the family and become the next king of Korea. I don't know who can tell. Also in the time of Jesus, if you read the BI Bible carefully, Herod's father was a bad guy and Herod himself, he wasn't the great guy, but actually he was sometimes moved by John the Baptist words that Herod. Yeah. And so actually there was a you know, if John the Baptist united with Jesus and they approached Herod in a subtle way, you can see from the Bible that he did have, even though he was a bad guy, he had some kind of conscience

that was sensitive to God's truth and there was a chance that he could have been converted. Yeah, it's always possible. Um I the situ I mean in Israel at the time of Jesus wasn't really wasn't a Jewish monarchy in that sense. It's basically they were just people installed by the Romans and Herod the Great himself. He was only he got his position because the Roman emperor put it gave him that job. He wasn't it wasn't in that sense part of the lineage of the house of David or anything. Uh it's it's not really comparable. Yeah. It's not it's different.

So is that okay? It's more. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Please. Um so the story of Jacob and we kind of discussed about what should have happened. Um makes me think if people do the best possible thing in the situation and they restore like that situation to the maximum. So if they if it had gone the way we had then maybe Jesus could have come much sooner. Mhm. maybe but the way it's um portrayed Bible it was kind of seems it was put the way like it was meant to go that way that Jacob went to his uncle Aan

and was cheated and he had to go through all these trials and then come eventually 21 years later and vow for his brother now after going through what should have happened or should have happened It seems more like that was to restore the way things weren't done properly and handing over. Yes. And it may have restored something between Jacob and Esau, but it didn't really restore very much because in the end they didn't work together after although he came back and they didn't Esau didn't want to kill him

but they didn't um right they Yes. So we'll talk about next week. They met it. They met. There was a reconciliation, but then they went their own way. And then from Jacob came the Jewish people. From Esau came the And it says they were often enemies. So Esau didn't invite him, right? After he invited him, come. Yes. And Jacob didn't want to, right? Because that per that time was gone. So Esau wasn't living in Canaan. Esau was living outside Canaan. is living in the land of Sea which is which was

uh on the east bank of the Dead Sea whereas Jacob wanted to go and live in Canaan and also you know it's like a lot of water passed under the bridge you know actually it's interesting Isaac's blessing which was intended for Esau did come true because in that blessing he says your brothers will die to you well that's right we'll we'll look at this next week but actually at the point of recon reconiliation. Then Jacob returned the blessing that he'd stolen or he taken from Esau, he gave it back to Esau.

So even though Rebecca had this dream, the elders shall serve the younger. What was it the dream again? One will be stronger than the other. The younger shall the elder will serve the younger. Is that Yeah. But actually in reality, you know, Jacob was the one who bowed down to Esau times. And to Jacob then was you Esau never bowed down to Jacob. You know it's a momentary reconciliation and then they went their separate ways. So they didn't really unite and make a proper foundation of faith in the sense

that you know of Esau really loving Jacob and respecting him and doing stuff together. It never got to that point. But do you think they in res in a restorational sense that they had restored a little bit more? Yeah. Oh yeah, definitely. Absolutely. Definitely. Well, again, we'll look at this next week. So, you know, Jacob got the birthright, which is important, but he wasn't able to establish a proper foundation of substance together with Esau. And so, they there was a reconciliation and then they went they went their separate ways.

So you're saying that again I'm using language here but there's no principled element to saying that Jacob was supposed to deceive steal from I mean if you look at the divine principle itself it doesn't say that the divine prince itself doesn't talk about anything about him taking Esau's blessing just says he needs to get the birthight and then he says he took Esau's blessing he took the blessing and God didn't bless as Esau. Um, but you know, unfortunately, for some reason, I don't know why, nobody has ever noticed this blessing before. It's not in the divine principle. Father never mentions it. None of the other church leaders have ever mentioned this blessing. Well, I think this it's a more significant first, right? Definitely.

So usually when people talk they say Jacob needed to get the blessing from Isaac as if there was one blessing the blessing. But actually if you read it there were two blessings. There was a blessing for Esau and a blessing for Jacob. And I think Jacob should have got his blessing and J I think Esau should have got his blessing and Jacob should have got that his blessing. And then you know that why not you know getting Esau's blessing is not about the foundation of substance. The foundation of substance is about winning Esau's love

and respect and uniting together. By taking Esau's blessing, it made it much more difficult for to establish the foundation substance because now Esau wants to kill him. Yes. He doesn't want to he doesn't love him. He doesn't respect him. He's absolutely not going to do anything together with him. Yeah. So actually by taking Esau's blessing, he almost made it impossible to make the foundation of substance. He almost got himself killed as if he hadn't taken Esau's blessing he wouldn't have got Esau wouldn't have got

so upset and then maybe together instead of spending 21 years in Haran he might have spent 21 years let's see if we can you know get some unity going together here the very strong in the prophecy one is stronger one is weaker one almost so even with Perez in the womb it's talking about power like one wrestle in the womb like force and power satanic mindset isn't using false empower but actually the language even suggested that so it's not surprising that well I mean you know I mean what should have happened is the elders should shall serve the younger that's what should have happened if the foundation substance had been established

then yes Esau would have realized Jacob is etc etc etc and I want to help him and serve him because I really respect him and I love him yes I think he'll become the better head of the family than But that prophecy that Rebecca had was never fulfilled because Esau never served Jacob. When did she get this prophecy? Does it say what meaning it was through? It was just through a dream. No. Well, was it through an angel or It just says that God spoke to her. Um could have just had a dream. Yeah. She Maybe it's a dream. Maybe it's an angel, maybe it was a voice of God, you know, she was talking to God about why is it

so painful having being pregnant, you know, and then God spoke to her and said this to her, "Two nations are in your womb. Two peoples born of you shall be divided. One should be stronger than the other. The elder shall serve the younger." But the reality is the elder never did serve the younger. Esau never did serve Jacob. But I also think there's a problem with language because in the fallen world, language takes on a different meaning. But in heaven, it's not the same meaning. For example, in the fallen world, there's a subject

and an object. And usually like a king or a dictator is a subject and the subject desires the object to obey him and also serve him. In the kingdom of heaven, the way it works is the subject serves the object and the object obeys the subject. So for example, parents serve their children, the children obey them. So an older brother would serve a younger brother and the younger brother would follow, listen to and obey his older brother. So actually from a follower point of view to be told you're going to serve this person is an insult.

But from a heavenly point of view to be told you're going to be you're going to serve this person is like saying you're an older brother position or a mature subject or a parent. So to be to be prophesied that Esau would serve Jacob seen from a heavenly point of view is not that terrible thing. That's not a problem at all. The point is that Jacob though needed to win his older brother's respect and he need to win the love and respect of his older brother and he and sadly he know he didn't do

that and he tricked him and deceived him and made himself less lovable and less respectable and then he had to go away for 21 years to be deceived himself many times to suddenly come to the realize actually no wonder Esau was so upset with me. It's not very nice being tricked. Yeah. And then he realized actually I behave badly to my brother. Yeah. 21 years. Some people never do. I mean I told you about Lucen and Clement Freud. Did I? No. Yeah. Lucen and Clement Freud. Is that two people? They're two brothers. Lucian Freud is the psychologist. No, Lucen Freud. Okay.

So, they're the grandchildren, I think, of Sigund. Anyway, so Lucian Freud is a is a very renowned painter, very famous painter, extraordinary paintings. Clement Freud was an MP, liberal MP. He was a cook, you know, on television before Jamie Oliver and also on the radio a lot. Anyway, it's my generation, not yours. Anyway, they're both very, very famous. They were brothers. Anyway, about three years ago, Lucien Freud died and people were shocked that Clement didn't go to his brother's funeral.

And then the story came out, you know, Clement, why didn't you go to your brother's funeral? Well, why should I? But he's your brother. We haven't spoken since we were 15. That's what happened when they were teenagers. The story came out later. When they were teenagers, there was something that they got into some kind of squabble or disagreement about something and they never spoke to each other again. And then as the years went by, it became even more difficult to contact each other. And so for you know there was I guess they're in the 70s 80s when they died maybe for 60 years these two brothers hadn't spoken to each other hadn't called each other hadn't visited each other they had no feeling for him didn't feel like this is my brother I should go to his funeral it was just like you know it's no different to anybody else. Yeah, this these things happen

and that you know it's it's a classic kind of story. And Clement said, "I can't even remember what it was that we argued about, you know, it was just couldn't even remember what the issue was anymore. It's just they just drifted apart." Yeah. So, it's very easy for that to happen and and not to try to reconcile. And so, that was, you know, obviously there's some issue here between Jacob and Esau. Jacob went away and they could have just stayed away. But later on he decided he wanted to make it up with Esau. You he felt it was important for him to restore what he had done wrong to go home

and make it up with Esau to go and apologize to do what was necessary to restore the relationship. It felt you know that was important something he had to do. Is it conceivable that the able person in able position does it the wrong way? For some miraculous reason, the person in position decides, you know, even though my brother tricked me, I'm still going to do God providence. I love him and serve him. Sure. Yeah. Of course, I don't think it happens. But uh yeah, if that did happen. Sure. These things happen. Yeah.

So even in our church life in the past, we talked about able figs figure, not necessarily internally like able type person, but members are encouraged to be faithful to them. Well, maybe that person's not an able figure then. Maybe it's just the leader. But and Cain. Yeah. I mean, so providentially speaking, Jacob was generally leader of the proidence to to Yeah. But generally speaking, Cain is older than Abel. So generally speaking, in the church, the leader is Cain and the younger members Abel. That's the basic principle. If you're a leader means you're older, means you've been in the church longer, which means basically you're canain. That's what father said.

And if you're just joined and you don't know anything, you're able. Yeah, that's that's the principle. Kane is older than able generally. So what's easier? Is it easier for a young member to listen to a church leader for a church leader to is listen to a young member? Sorry. last church that well what do you think you know just imagine what's easier it's easier for a young person to listen it is much it's easier for a young brother to listen to an older brother that's natural okay it's easier for K able to listen to Kane it's easy he's older you know he's been around longer etc it's much more difficult the other way round it's much more difficult for a church leader to listen to somebody who just joined Not just in the church, anywhere, you know,

because young What do young people like usually? Sorry. Bit immature. Yes. But often quite enthusiastic. A little bit idealistic. And if you've been around a long time, what are you more like? Realist. Realistic. Bit cyn bit cynical. And it's very easy when somebody comes along with lots of new ideas. Oh, well, you know, you just don't understand, you know, just you'll learn. Just put you down. That's like Cain killing Abel. Yes. And it's very easy to be like that when you get older to think, oh, well, you they're just full of all this, you know, innocent enthusiasm, they'll grow out of it one day. As opposed to they're

so enthusiastic, maybe, you know, I should, you know, become associate with them a bit more and to lose some of my old cynicism. mentioned that in a speech once it's like when new members join and older members say oh don't you they'll calm down and you just kind of like chastity absolutely it's absolutely wrong yes yes yes and so as I said the basic rule is the leader's came so the whole idea this is my able figure is completely a misunderstanding of the principle the leaders came the older one is came as a basic you know it's a basic standpoint point as he told me many of the amazing projects father has started he took suggestions from younger members

and of course he's old now so he's younger than father but many of the great projects he started his ideas he listen to younger members sure and he said he recognized that's a great idea he didn't say I'm the messiah how dare you come that's right yes so father is a very humble person if you're very humble he recognized truth wherever it comes from it may be somebody you really don't like but they may come up with a good idea idea you and so you should feel well even though I don't like you actually that's a good idea you know as opposed to well

because it's you then it's obviously a bad idea which is so easy to do that you know what I mean yes so a humble person says well you know I may have difficulties with you and I but actually you know actually it's a good idea and that's what it is to be humble to recognize truth for its own sake and irrespective to whe the person somebody you like or not. Anyway, so I this is just my own experience. You know, the years of being a church leader, I felt basically I'm Kane of the first time when they evil figures evil figures. Evil figures when they figures. Yes. That's right. Yes.

So the leader the church leader with certain responsibility one can never you know one has to respect this person is the one who has is a leader or the one who is responsible yeah but you know maybe that person might be able to you but maybe they're not but person if you have that kind of position you shouldn't think well because I have this position therefore I am able and you shouldn't think that person's necessarily your able figure. Your able figure is something you decide yourself in your heart of hearts. You feel actually this person is closer to God than me. This is somebody through whom I need to learn.

And it may be your church leader. It may be a you meet on the street. It could be anybody. It could be a particular book that you're reading. Wow, this is amazing. I need to learn from this. So, we use this K. We use K because lots of problems have been up for years, you know. Yeah, it has completely. It's we we I'm first time. I gave a long talk about it a couple a few weeks ago. Were you Did you miss that one? I think you were you missed that one. It's online if you want to watch. I talked about it for I looked it up

and able to cause problems. Yeah. Lots of problems. I looked it up and father said something interesting. He said vertically younger members are able and older members are king and horizontally older members are able and younger members are king. And I think what he means by that is if you're older you have more experience about running things and so in that way you can give some wisdom to the younger man. Sure. God is more likely to be stronger than Yeah. So that's what I said before. You know, you may be able in one thing

but keen in another thing. You know, you may be better at playing tennis in that sense. You're able and that person can learn from you. Whereas in a different sport, it may be the other way round or in a religious life it may be the other way around. So, you know, it just varies depends on the circumstance and situation. Some things one might be able the other person's cane might be completely opposite way round. In a different circumstance, a different situation. It's just something flexible.

And so the key then is to try and be sensitive to where is God working through whom is God working through whom is God speaking. Yes. You know just because one's a leader doesn't mean one has a monopoly on God. Nobody has a monopoly on God. Not even the Messiah has a monopoly on God. God is able to speak and work wherever he wants to. This sense because somebody's a leader they're able is still completely prevailent in our church. Isn't it? Yes. And even though I think you showed me a quote where father said it's an evil philosophy

that our church members are teaching that the leader is evil. I didn't you didn't say evil but certainly say it's wrong. Yes. Yeah. I mean I went yeah I went through all these quotes a few weeks ago. Yeah. There's loads of them. You can look at all father's quotes about Kain Abel but never ever will you find he says you know the church leader is able. Therefore you have to follow the church leader. Doesn't say that. Yes. So you're on a different note about Isaac. Yes. And there's also been some popularization of this term in terms of, you know, something

that you feel is precious to you and that you would you would rather keep than to, you know, sacrifice in God's name or to go in that sort of direction. Um, what do you think about that? Well, again, it's it's something that you it's not somebody can tell you that it becomes an abuse when people say, "Well, you have to do it because it's your Isaac." This is something that you feel from God directly. You may feel from God actually it's necessary for me to do this you know but at the end of the day important thing is did God did Abraham kill Isaac? No that's the thing God Abraham did not sacrifice Isaac. Yes. He was willing to do it. It was only the willingness. He didn't have to do he didn't actually do it. Whereas often people say actually it's not just the willingness you actually have to do it.

But also so what do you think about like sorry what do you think about someone say giving up their studies to do like I mean typical case would be to do another year of SDF and they're told you know this is the wrong thing to do because it's your eyes. I think that's something that a person needs to work out themselves in their heart of hearts. I don't I think it's a violation of somebody's inner life to tell them that and to say that that's something everybody has to work out for themselves. Also, isn't it just to say

because this is precious to you, you have to you have to crash it without any context. Well yes. The idea that if it's pressure to you, you've got to get rid of itself. Well, I agree. As I said, I don't think people should I think it's a misuse of power to do that. misuse of the principle to go around telling people that then also what you could use that thing for potentially if say for example studying you could go on to have greater influence in society. Sure. So you know I think you know if you want to study

and you love studying you should really study that's what God wants you to do but at the same time you should always be aware that you know to love God more than that. That's all it is really. It's not that God doesn't I said God